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人类的玻璃心

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发表于 2018-9-12 21:17 | 显示全部楼层 |阅读模式
.       隔壁‘雅利安们’的文化自豪感应该是一直都非常高,这从他们的吠陀经开始,一直到现在的印度教文化可以看出。

       不过近期他们可能非常烦恼,因为现在人类开始掌握了aDNA检测技术,而且这门科学也逐渐开始普照这块古老的土地。不过令现代印度雅利安们比较烦恼的是,根据分子人类学的最新研究成果,他们之前一直引以为傲的哈拉帕古文明,现在来看极有可能与他们伟大的雅利安先祖无关。这对于他们来说无异于是一个噩耗,乖乖,这怎么得了!

        当然,也不是所有的印度知识分子都是‘本土起源论’铁粉,比如这位作者,这两天就开始拿‘雅利安们’开涮,不妨拿来分享一下,也算是茶余饭后的有趣的消遣吧,呵呵

Rakhigarhi: DNA study bolsters the idea that migrations 4,000 years ago brought Sanskrit to India  https://scroll.in/article/893308 ... indus-valley-people


    (撷取其中的精华翻译如下)
(You might assume only geneticists and serious nerds would be interested in Y-chromosome DNA haplogroups, which are gene clusters showing descent from a common male ancestor. Yet, one such haplogroup, known as R1a, has become integral to the fierce debate about India’s ancient history.
   An individual who died some 4,500 years ago in Rakhigarhi in present day Haryana is entangled in the R1a controversy.
  Political pressure delayed an eagerly awaited study of that man’s genetic make-up, but it finally seems ready for print, and its findings were summarised in India Today by the magazine’s Managing Editor Kai Friese. Friese’s article was less about what the researchers found than what they didn’t find. What they didn’t find was the marker R1a.)

     你可能会认为只有遗传学家和严肃的书呆子,才会对事关同一个雄性祖先的 Y染色体DNA单倍群感兴趣。 然而,有一个这样的单倍体群,或称之为R1a,已成为当下关于印度古代历史的激烈辩论中不可或缺的一部分。

     大约4500年前在拉希加里(Rakhigarhi遗址,以前印度学界定义为‘早期哈拉帕文化’,现在一般称为‘印度河谷文明’)死亡的一个人,如今却深陷于一场关于R1a的大争议之中而不得安宁。
     政治的压力一度推迟了人们期待已久的关于该男子基因构成的研究,但是研究成果最终还是准备出版,《印度今日》的执行编辑Kai Friese先在杂志上发表一篇总结性介绍。不过他的这篇文章,更多的是关于研究人员没有发现的东西,比如说,他们没有找到的是R1a单倍群(可能是印度雅利安人最希望找到的,呵呵)

      如果检测到该标记的话,印度民族主义者一定会欣喜若狂。 他们坚信,印度河谷文明’古人与吠陀经上说的没有什么不同,这样,他们会感到被证明是正确的,这些哈拉帕、Mohenjo-daro,Dholavira和Rakhigarhi等古城的居民 必然崇拜的是印度教的神灵; 印度最早的城市文化应该被称为印度 卍文明。
     “印度正确运动”数十载以来一直在收集各种证据,全力以赴宣扬另一种可能,吠陀经其实是在印度河谷文明高峰期的很久以后,是由另一群不早于4000多年前的移民编写的,他们说着来自一种来自东欧和中亚草原的语言。
 楼主| 发表于 2018-9-12 21:19 | 显示全部楼层
(续前)
    The story of India
For those who follow evidence rather than ideology, the story of how India was populated is now fairly clear. It will continue to be refined and fleshed out, but here is the gist of it. Around 70,000 years ago, bands of anatomically modern humans began migrating out of Africa. They eventually occupied virtually every inhabitable place on earth, arriving in India at least 50,000 years ago.

Around 10,000 years ago, a second massive migration was triggered by the discovery of agriculture and a consequent population explosion. In a region of West Asia known as the fertile crescent, humans learned to grow wheat and barley and domesticated cattle, goats, sheep and pigs. They took this knowledge west into Europe and east through Iran to South Asia. Agriculture was invented independently a little later in China and later still in Mexico. Rice cultivation came to India from the east, but the associated migration did not have as strong an impact on India’s population as the one from Iran.

               印度的故事

对于那些追随证据而不是意识形态的人来说,印度如何居住的故事现在已经相当清楚了。它将继续精炼和充实,先简要介绍一下。

   大约7万年前,解剖学上现代人类群体开始迁出非洲。在他们最终占据地球上几乎每个可居住的地方之前,他们至少在5万年前已经抵达印度。

   大约一万年前,农业的发现,和随之而来的人口爆炸,引发了第二次大规模迁移。在被称为肥沃新月的西亚地区,人类学会种植小麦和大麦以及驯养的牛,山羊,绵羊和猪。他们将这种知识带到了西部,进入欧洲,从东部通过伊朗到达南亚。中国稍后独立发明了农业,继之在墨西哥。后来水稻种植从东方传到印度,但相关的迁徙对印度人口的影响 没有像伊朗对印度那样强烈。
 楼主| 发表于 2018-9-12 21:27 | 显示全部楼层
After the coming of agriculture, the economy of North India grew steadily, till it was large enough to support towns like Harappa and Dholavira. The people of these towns, and of the Indus Valley civilisation more broadly, were a mix of two groups: indigenous hunter gatherers descended from the first waves of migrants out of Africa, and farmers who had arrived much more recently. Since individuals would have carried genes from the two groups in different proportions, the population must have looked diverse.


    农业来临后,印度北部的经济开始稳步增长,直到它足以支持哈拉帕和多拉维拉Dholavira等城镇。 这些城镇的人民,和更广泛的印度河流域文明,是两个群体的混合体:一种是早期出非洲的土著狩猎采集者,另一种则是最近来到这里的农民。 由于两种基因的混合,因此群体必然会看起来更多样化。



 楼主| 发表于 2018-9-12 21:41 | 显示全部楼层
Out of Steppe
Around 6,000 years ago, a new migration began from the grasslands north of the Black Sea, spurred by the invention of horse riding. Horses had been hunted by Stone Age inhabitants of Europe and Asia for millennia, but their domestication and use as steeds was first achieved by semi-nomadic pastoral communities on the Eurasian steppe. The horse people of the grasslands became formidable warriors, especially after they learned to hitch spoke-wheeled chariots to their horses.

Moving outwards from the steppe, they spread what would become their biggest contribution to the modern world: their language. It was the ancestor of Greek, Latin, Old Iranian, Sanskrit, and all their daughter tongues, now known as the Indo-European language family. Today, over 40% of the world’s people speak a mother tongue descended from the language of those nomads of the steppe.

出草原纪

    大约6000年前,由于骑马的发明,从黑海北部的草原开始了新的迁徙(作者可能说错了关于日期)。  数千年来,欧洲和亚洲的石器时代居民一直在追捕马匹,但是马匹的驯化和用作骏马,最初是由欧亚草原上的半游牧牧民实现的。 草原上的‘骑马者’变成了强大的战士,特别是在他们学会将轮辐战车拖到他们的马匹上之后。

     从草原向外扩散,他们传播了他们的语言---希腊语,拉丁语,古老伊朗语,梵语---现在被称为印欧语系。 今天,世界上超过40%的人说的母语是这种草原游牧民族的语言。
 楼主| 发表于 2018-9-12 21:52 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 imvivi001 于 2018-9-12 22:00 编辑

(续前)
The incursion of the horse riders into India left a genetic imprint, with one very peculiar quality: The steppe genes were transmitted primarily by males. There is a form of DNA, called mitochondrial DNA, which is passed from mother to progeny. The mitochondrial DNA of modern Indians shows little steppe influence, meaning that females from among the pastoral migrants did not mate with or marry males from communities already settled within India in significant numbers. The men, on the other hand, left their mark on Indian Y chromosomes, the most famous being the R1a haplotype.

I hope it is clear now why the Rakhigarhi study was politically fraught. The presence of R1a would have undercut the idea that a migration originating in the steppes brought Sanskrit to India at a time when the Indus Valley civilisation was in decline. I am not surprised no R1a was found.
    In a previous column I set down some of the evidence showing that Sanskrit and the Vedic religion have their origins outside the subcontinent. Recent genetic data only bolsters what we know from other disciplines like archaeology, linguistics and comparative religion
   .......

骑马入侵者给印度留下了遗传印记,一种非常特殊的印记:草原基因主要由雄性传播。有一种称为线粒体的DNA,它从母体传给后代。现代印度人的线粒体DNA显示出很少的草原影响,这意味着牧民移民中的女性,没有与已经在印度定居的社区中的男性交配或结婚。另一方面,这些人在印度Y染色体上留下了印记,最著名的是R1a单倍型。

      我希望大家清楚为什么Rakhigarhi的研究在政治上充满了困难。 R1a的存在会削弱这样一种观点,即在印度河流域文明衰落的时候,源于大草原的迁移将梵语带到了印度,因此没有找到R1a我并不感到惊讶。
     在上一篇专栏文章中,我提出了一些证据表明,梵文和吠陀宗教的起源不属于次大陆。最近的遗传数据只能加强我们对其他学科的了解,如考古学,语言学和比较宗教学。


      来自Rakhigarhi的男子据说在基因上接近Irula族的成员,这是一个生活在泰米尔纳德邦和喀拉拉邦的Adivasi族群,他们的传统职业是捕捉老鼠和蛇。 这种联系强化了印度河流域古人使用达罗毗荼语的常见假设,并且来自西北的马上入侵者造成了南迁的波浪。 由于这些动荡,今天印度北部人中有很大一部分携带“草原基因”,不过几乎所有印度人,包括Adivasis都带有“农民基因”。
     研究人员提出了像ANI,Ancestral North Indian和ASI,Ancestral South Indian这样的术语来,描述不同的假设人群。我没有使用这些术语,因为我发现它们具有误导性。例如,ANI人群与印度北部没有什么关系(的确如此,不准确的地理学术语是会带来一些困扰与误导的)
 楼主| 发表于 2018-9-12 22:49 | 显示全部楼层
(续前)
The Hindutva view
A few intellectuals from the Hindu Right have attempted to reconcile Hindutva history with genetic, archaeological and linguistic evidence. They make two arguments against the story of migration I have sketched. They attack it as racist, and claim we only have proof of migrations but no proof of the direction of those migrations. In the Hindutva view, Indian horse riders migrated to the steppes, taking with them R1a and the mother of Indo-European languages, not the other way round.

Sanjeev Sanyal, Principal Economic Advisor to the Ministry of Finance, who has written Hindutva-friendly books of popular history, expressed these views in a Twitter thread, along with a couple of other tendentious claims, after a major study of the genetics of south and central Asia reinforced the established view of migration into India. Sanyal uploaded a photograph of a prehistoric depiction of a horse, with the comment,

     ................

    印度中心主义者的观点

     一些来自“印度正确运动”的知识分子,试图将印度教历史与遗传,考古和语言证据相协调。 他们对我上面说的移民故事提出了两个反对论据:首先,这个故事是种族主义者编造的;同时,声称我们只有移民证明,但没有证据证明这些移民的方向。 在印度教徒的观点中,是印度骑马者迁移到大草原,带去了他们R1a和印欧语系的祖语,而不是相反。

      财政部首席经济顾问桑杰耶夫·萨亚尔(Sanjeev Sanyal)曾经撰写过一系列印度教徒喜闻乐见的印度通俗历史书籍,不过在认真研究了关于中亚与南亚的遗传结构之后,坚定了关于移民进入印度的既定观点,并在Twitter帖子中表达了这些观点以及其他一些倾向性的主张。
     野马,就像15000多年前在法国拉斯科洞穴中绘制的那样,在现代人类出现之前,已经在亚洲和欧洲漫游了数百万年。但是草原人的创新,是驯化他们,骑他们,并将他们绑在轮辐战车上。虽然战马在吠陀神话中起着重要作用,不过在成熟的印度河流域古文明中,仍没有发现这类车辆的残骸。

       Sanyal的第二个论点是R1a从东向西传播,因为“印度是唯一一个像R2,R1b这样的表兄弟被发现的地方”。   尽管我的遗传学知识未必比他好,但是看起来他关于R1b的看法应该是不真实的,因为它在印度几乎不存在。
       除了这个事实错误之外,关于东西方论点的核心问题是,如果是印度人将R1a带到西部和北部,印度相关DNA的其他成分将会出现在西方人口中,但这种情况并未发生。(作者的这个逻辑尤其值得中国的北线迷恋者们认真学习,呵呵)

      基于这个事实,关于由东向西的迁移论,就像声称你可以彻底混合三种颜色并将它们涂抹在一张普通纸上,然后却使得三种颜色中只有一种沉积在纸张的表面上一样。
 楼主| 发表于 2018-9-12 22:57 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 imvivi001 于 2018-9-12 23:00 编辑

Product of imperialism
The most persistent argument against the steppe migration thesis is that .........

帝国主义的产物

     反对草原移民论的最持久的论点是,它是种族主义,是帝国主义思想的产物。用Sanyal的话来说,“一旦你摆脱了关于北方白人征服者的种族主义假设,现有的数据就非常一致。”    虽然“征服者”确实比印度河谷城市的大多数居民更加白皮肤,其实我们不知道他们的精确肤色是什么,所以称他们为“白色”是误导。其次,定居的农业社会在许多方面比草原牧民更先进。农民建造了城市,发明了文字系统并开发了复杂的贸易路线,而牧民则是文盲的游牧民族。尽管他们在一方面的确无可置疑地优越:比如他们在战争中表现得更好。
     在Sanyal的三个类别中,“白色”,“优越”和“来自北方”,只有最后一个准确地呈现了草原迁移论文。他关于种族主义的断言,就像关于种族主义的那样,也是不堪一击的。

     确实,种族主义者过去曾利用对印欧语言传播的研究。 纳粹认原始印欧语人群是白皮肤金发碧眼的北欧人,他们在征服劣等种族的同时传播他们的语言。 然而,纳粹关于“雅利安人”的地理起源和种族的观点在几十年前就已经失去了信誉。
 楼主| 发表于 2018-9-12 23:15 | 显示全部楼层
The more we learn about the past the crazier white supremacy sounds. It seems likely, for example, that Stone Age inhabitants of places like Britain and Spain were dark skinned. They grew pale relatively recently, thanks substantially to a genetic mutation probably brought to Western Europe by farmers from Asia, and first identified by scientists studying the pigmentation of zebrafish.
    .....................

      我们对过去了解的越深入,就会更加觉得白色优越论的论调是多么的荒谬。 例如,英国和西班牙等地的石器时代居民应该是皮肤黝黑的。他们变成白种人不过是比较晚近的事情,而这主要归功于亚洲农民可能带到西欧的基因突变,这个论点首先由研究斑马鱼色素沉着的科学家证实了。

       在英国,没有人反对祖先是黑皮肤的说法。 法国人也没有组织任何游行,来抗议农业是在亚洲发明的观念; 意大利人完全满足于他们的语言起源于西欧之外。 瑞典人则高兴地承认现代人类起源于非洲。 这些理论都基于过硬的数据以及客观的解释,而不是种族主义。 而与客观假设相对立的观点则是:偏见、沙文主义、再加上扭曲的自卑情结,驱使我们难以摆脱这样的断言:我们的祖先一直都是在崇拜雅利安的神、一直在说这种雅利安语言,一直是看起来像现在这样,一直生活在这里...
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